mercuryroad: Reality is sometimes hard to swallow. And it gets buried under political correctness.
No, I am not talking about dollface’s appearance. Look beyond face value and go for the real base! I’m referring to the ACTUAL situation where Arabs hook low-IQ American women who refuse to use their brains and endanger not only themselves, but their country!!
Throw in a few sweet I-love-you-to-death sentences, get your green card into the US and proceed to the next level — is this modus operandi so hard for you to infer?

anonymous twit on June 22, 2006 at 10:56 pm

No I am not Matthew Udall. Nice try tho.
I see that stupidity abounds once more on VJ. Trying to verify Debbies age so she can be phoned and harrassed? Talk about fodder for a lawsuit, and openly admitting your intention. Dumbass.
And as far as Stephen Palick, the ‘former’ owner of VJ. He is still very much the man behind the scenes at VJ. If you dont believe me why dont you ask Sassycat, Bopeep, Gemmacat, Flyergirl, Darb, and Rubywine all about that. Why do you think none of them post anymore when at one time they all ruled the site right along with Steve. Still do. They all helped Steve keep up the facade of the site being run/owned by someone else in order to protect Steve from Mr. Udall. Quite the clique they had going at one time.
I seem to recall it was two of the group mentioned above that were the ones responsible for banning Mr. Udall. Kinda makes you wonder why they dropped off the face of the earth all of a sudden.
So if you think Steve wants something as silly as this to go to court, think again. Steve would be shown for the fake he is, and I might add, probably get in trouble for giving out users IP addresses to his little buddies as well.
Just something to chew on kiddies while your readying your tar and feathers for Debbie.

Gumby on June 22, 2006 at 10:56 pm

“mercuryroad: Reality is sometimes hard to swallow. And it gets buried under political correctness.
No, I am not talking about dollface’s appearance. Look beyond face value and go for the real base! I’m referring to the ACTUAL situation where Arabs hook low-IQ American women who refuse to use their brains and endanger not only themselves, but their country!!”
Certainly you have an odd way of expressing yourself because you stated she was good looking by Arab standards but ugly in the U.S. I’m confused as to how that comment was directed at her IQ (which you have no way of knowing) rather than her appearance.
You are basically saying that anyone American woman that marries an Arab man is ugly and has no IQ. Yet, if they married an American white man that would be ok.
That is a racist comment and there’s nothing politically correct driving my statement. There can be no rebuttal nor excuse for such a remark about someone you do not know.

mercuryroad on June 22, 2006 at 11:25 pm

“No I am not Matthew Udall. Nice try tho.”
Still dodging the question at hand I see. Really that states everything that needs to be known about you. You were given ample opportunity to stand up as a man and defend your position by identifying yourself. Instead you have chosen a cowardly path and choose to shoot your verbal bullets at our backs from the shadows.
Those are cowardly acts indeed and speak to the true nature of your character. Why would anyone listen to what you have to say when you are villifying the very people that you commiserate with so frequently. By any definition, that is a traitor.
You have quite an extensive knowledge about the site and are clearly a member, thus deriving value from the site yet you come on here to deface it.
What exactly is your agenda and why do you lurk in the shadows?
What possible gain do you have in that?

mercuryroad on June 22, 2006 at 11:30 pm

I am going to be very naive for a moment…but it’s worth a try! 🙂
Debbie,
can you please take down the photos above of the couples you had found online at the site visajourney and the specific info about them. Make your point some other way, not by using misleading info about these couples who are now very hurt.
Please be “the better person” and do this. I am asking this simply. It doesn’t hurt to just ask, right?

mashedpotatoes on June 22, 2006 at 11:31 pm

“Please be “the better person” and do this. I am asking this simply. It doesn’t hurt to just ask, right? ”
Any good person of faith would honor such a request.

mercuryroad on June 22, 2006 at 11:37 pm

Please Debbie, make your point another way. I implore your sense of humanity to not be this cruel.

hrmmm1234 on June 22, 2006 at 11:40 pm

“Certainly you have an odd way of expressing yourself because you stated she was good looking by Arab standards but ugly in the U.S. I’m confused as to how that comment was directed at her IQ (which you have no way of knowing) rather than her appearance.”
If you cannot comprehend what I posted, I won’t blame you for it. You figure out the reason yourself!
“You are basically saying that anyone American woman that marries an Arab man is ugly and has no IQ. Yet, if they married an American white man that would be ok.”
You need to take a 101 lesson in Logic at the nearest community college. Your argument is lousy.
“That is a racist comment and there’s nothing politically correct driving my statement.”
What was racist in that? Isn’t that a pattern we have observed in all these people?
“There can be no rebuttal nor excuse for such a remark about someone you do not know.”
You do not have to know someone personally to deduce certain facts about him/her. Do you have to know any of the terrorists or terrorist supporters to figure that they are dangerous to this country?

anonymous twit on June 22, 2006 at 11:47 pm

“Your argument is lousy.”
I agree…it’s yours precisely. It is not hard to deduce your theory from the information provided. You may wish to back pedal at this point but your observations were quite clear.
“You do not have to know someone personally to deduce certain facts about him/her. Do you have to know any of the terrorists or terrorist supporters to figure that they are dangerous to this country?”
I’m glad you find yourself to be qualified as a judge and jury. Even in a court of law circumstantial evidence is not enough to convict so why do you feel so compelled to do it here?
You cannot ascertain from the information given, which some of it was false by the way, that these women from VJ are marrying terrorists.
I suspect if you were in their situation, you would see things very differently. Or would you never be involved with an Arab woman?

mercuryroad on June 22, 2006 at 11:54 pm

Where is Ms. Schlussel? Her absence in this discussion is deafening. There are clear objections to her points and I would think she would offer a rebuttal of some sort to further explain her position and actions regarding this matter.
Also, there were a few pleas to remove the pictures from the victims who did not wish to be a part of this and have expressed a simple request to have the pictures removed.
What kind of vengeful person would leave them up after such a simple request? I sincerely hope this is not an issue of pride.
Those request are not unreasonable Ms. Schlussel. If it were you, you would want them removed also. It would be a gracious act to see them removed. Why must we beg?

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 12:00 am

anonymous twit….you have a lot of nerve…all these people who made comments about me, why dont you slap a picture of you on here and let us all judge you by 2 false statements and a picture…This was a horrible move on your part Debbie, you know nothing of me, or my husband….the “Story of my life” on Visajourney is a mere outline of my immigration process to let fellow VJ’ers know what they might encounter if they are going thru the same process.. I am a bright women, with a huge future ahead of me, and you have no place putting my story out in front of the world for scrutiny…..and maybe you should look further into the immigration process….all immigrants go there HARDCORE background checks, and they continue for a long time here in the United States…The embassy just doesnt hand a friggin visa over to any person…..Know your stuff before u post lady! Your assumptions of my husband and I are very wrong…your facts arent even straight…How did u just assume my husband was palestinian, and how do you presume to think we dont know one another…What my timeline failed to tell you was we have known eachother a long time….I have travelled to jordan numerous times, and actually lived in Jordan, under the care of my husband and his family for a year! Your a sorry writer..and a very sad women….To make up lies to draw attention to your “fan club” was low

dollface41601 on June 23, 2006 at 12:01 am

Traitor? Mighty strong words there Merc when you don’t even know me or anything about me. Again, I’m not Mr. Udall, but I am one of the few who thought he contributed to VJ and was run off and tarred and feathered by the very same brush you’re all using to tar and feather Debbie with.
My point is this. You’re all crying foul and demanding that Steve (Ewok, Wookie and how ever many other id’s he has) do something. Well kids, Steve isn’t stupid, he knows that should he get into this cockup it could very well shut the site down, for good and heaven forbid that should happen. Because we all know that nothing bad ever happens on VJ. Frankly that’s dogs bollocks. Bad things do happen and people do get led astray by erroneous advice given out there.
All Steve can do is demand the photos be removed from Debbies blog as well as the timeline info that was pinched. She stated her opinion and there is nothing defamatory or libelous in doing so, therefore there is no grounds for a law suit.
Villifying the very people I commiserate with? Oh please, get over yourself. I stopped “commiserating” with that tribe of lunatics when people like Sassycat and Bopeep, Junaid, and the whole lot started villifying someone who was simply trying to keep innocents from being given misinformation on a website. There never was any “handover”. It was all a huge facade Stephen Palick put on to keep Matthew Udall from trying to shut the site down. And in doing so, people who were moderating the site (and who still are), Sassycat, Bopeep, Gemmacat, Flyergirl and the rest, were all accessories to his deception and helped him scapegoat his way out of any true responsibility.
And while your all out there having a hissy fit over Debbie’s OPINION and making horses asses out of yourselves, why don’t you ask Steve about all those IP addresses he’s given to the other moderators so they can go and see who is who. And ask him about all the “pm snooping” they do. Reading everyone’s pms and laughing about it in their little hidden moderator forums.
If there is no UPL on the site, then why is Steve hiding who he is? If he hasn’t done anything wrong, then why all the deception? And that kiddies is why you’ll never see anything of your silly suggestions about a law suit. Because Steve knows it would blow his whole house of cards to smithereens.
Well not to mention you have no grounds for a law suit. And you’ve probably just increased Debbies site hits tenfold at least.
You all look pretty stupid and immature having a fit about what you perceive as wrong, yet your all lowering yourselves to her level with your snide comments and threats to call and harrass her. If anyone has grounds for a lawsuit, its Debbie.

Gumby on June 23, 2006 at 12:05 am

“ummmmmmmmmmmmm Sofyan isnt palestinian….lol….assumptions much?
UMMMMMMMMMMMMM, HE’S JORDANIAN, WHICH MEANS HE’S ALMOST CERTAINLY PALESTINIAN, AS UPWARDS OF 75% OF ALL JORDANIANS ARE, IN FACT, PALESTINIANS…………LOL……….KNOWLEDGE MUCH.
DEBBIE SCHLUSSEL”
woooooow You are so naive…do u know anything of middle eastern people….yes 60% of people LIVING in jordan are palestinian….that doesnt disregard the people living there who didnt immigrate there….but my husband was born and raised there, as were his parents, decents of their jordanian parents, who were decents of their jordanian parents…and so on….your sooo dumb….wait, go live there for a year, learn my husbands ancestry since your soooo concerned ….then you might have the right to make judgements, until then….Go to hell

dollface41601 on June 23, 2006 at 12:08 am

Gumby,
If Steve is indeed the site owner and moderator of visajourney still, I believe the members would rejoice instead of be mad. It would be a great thing.
Not all are lowering themselves to her level (so by saying that all are lowering themselves down to her level, you’d agree she got down and dirty?).
I have no idea why you would wish to divulge your wealth of info on this website. I have a feeling most visajourney members would not be bothered with the information you are divulging. If Steve was still in charge, it’d sound like good news.
Why you are defending the article so staunchly, is another mystery we may not find out about.
All I can do is to nicely ask Debbie to take down the pictures.

mashedpotatoes on June 23, 2006 at 12:13 am

This is a message from my Moroccan husband in response to this outrage:
Look,I am a Muslim and I treat my wife the best possible way….I prey 5 times a day …before I pray I wash my body completely including my a&^ (5 times a day) and I am sure that my a$% is cleaner then your mouth…It is difficult to understand these things but believe me that this is the only truth…I hope that you will do some thinking on this subject…I think that your post is a sign of desperation and a cry for some attention…from a proud moroccan – JAMAL

ella74ny on June 23, 2006 at 12:21 am

Gumby,
I mentioned nothing of a law suit on VJ or on this forum. A simple request has been made to remove these photos per the request of the girls. I do not feel that to be unreasonable. Others can have their opinions and they are entitled so please do not group those thoughts in with mine.
You know far too much not to be active on VJ so please do not insult my intelligence by implying you have not been on there for over a year. How exactly did you find this thread then? The information you have could not be gleaned in 5 minutes, which means you either are an active poster or you lurk. The purpose of which is still unknown and you dodged that question as well.
For someone with such strong opinions, I wonder why you fear giving out your true identity. Surely if your beliefs are as firm as you state, you would have no problem with people knowing who they came from.
The traitor comment stands. You frequent VJ on some basis and have now attacked it in a different forum. The people that post on there could very well be your friends for all we know. But we don’t know do we? The reason is that you will not reveal yourself. So please, help me understand how you are not a traitor. Your actions seem to indicate as much.
I don’t know the owner nor do I have any tangible information proving the existance of the alligations against Steve. I would like to see your evidence as well to substantiate your claim. I think that is fair and within reason.
What is your fear in revealing your identity?

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 12:23 am

Spud –
I’m defending her right to express her OPINION. You all seem to forget that this is her OPINION! No where has she stated that she has evidence that the people mentioned are committing any kind of immigration fraud. It’s her OPINION that women in the US with low self esteem who are often times overweight are most often those who middle eastern men prey upon when trying to gain entry into the US. Not a damn thing wrong with stating that.
And who in their right mind marries someone after only chatting with them on the internet? I mean really, come on. There is nothing wrong with calling a spade a spade and that’s what Debbie has done and it’s all she’s done.
It’s you folks who have turned this into the world cup of pissing matches and it will be you folks who are to blame should anything happen to Visa Journey.
Bully for Steve if he’s to be welcomed out of the shadows and can do away with all the foney ID’s and be honest about why he did what he did. Why the lies though about handing the site over if he didn’t do anything wrong? Why can’t you type the phrase “My advice to you” if there’s nothing wrong with it, implied or otherwise?
I can’t see him jumping up and filing a lawsuit over an OPINION.
And why is it so wrong for an American woman to be concerned over how many men from middle eastern countries which are predominantly Islamic and Muslim, many of which are radicals, why is it so wrong for her to be concerned over these men pouring over our borders. Look at JennPrincess’ post. Kinda brings Debbie’s point home all the more.

Gumby on June 23, 2006 at 12:34 am

ella74ny:
“Look,I am a Muslim and I treat my wife the best possible way….I prey 5 times a day”
Does your Moroccan husband prey 5 times a day on myspace.com too?

anonymous twit on June 23, 2006 at 12:58 am

Merc
I fail to see the importance in who I am or am not. But Iím not Mr. Udall. Donít know how many times I can state that before going blue in the face.
Why donít you contact any one of the people Iíve mentioned above, they all know the whole story and one especially is easy enough to find.
Sassycat= Marleene Shaw
Bopeep = Aubrey Watters
Gemmacat = Christina Allan
Flyergirl = Tam Shiebental
Rubywine= Pauline Buzwell
Darb = Claudette Smith
Ewok/Wookie/Steve/jamienluv/kewl= Stephen Palik
Aubrey is easy enough to find, well she was for me anyhow. She writes books and is a DJ in Portland Maine who just had a baby. Sibsie, another former VJ moderator was the one who told me that it was Aubrey who was the one who banned Mr. Udall from the site and that the other women above took part in harassing and haranguing him.
Why are they still helping Steve hide who he really is and keep up the huge charade? If UPL isnít bad or isnít happening on VJ then why the huge farce?
Again, this is why nothing will come of your cries to flog Debbie in a court of law. It would likely bring VJ down and well it should be. And those people responsible for alienating an lawyer who was only trying to help those genuinely seeking to immigrate to the US should be the ones who face litigation. And Iíll do whatever I can to help.

Gumby on June 23, 2006 at 1:01 am

Gumby,
You are diverting this argument from the real issue. The issue was not with her opinion but rather with her representation of the facts and the deplorable nature in which information regarding our sisters misused and represented on this forum.
We simply ask that these photos are removed.
As for your beef with the prior owner of VJ, I don’t know what to tell you. The environment there today is one of support. It is not a perfect family and we have our fights, but we manage to get through it and carry on. Your past beef should remain just that….in the past.
Even bringing up that argument is a shameless attempt to divert attention away from the real issue. The photos should be removed and your identity (for your own credibility sake) should be revealed.
Your agenda regarding VJ really has no place here nor in this discussion.
Ms. Schlussel can have her opinion as she is entitled. However, it is respectfully requested that this is not done at the expense of unknowing victims. All we ask is for the photos to be removed.
As I’ve stated….this is not an unreasonable request and any good person of faith would comply.

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:05 am

“Does your Moroccan husband prey 5 times a day on myspace.com too?”
There is no purpose in such a comment other than to incite anger. Inciting anger is a tactic of terrorists. I find it ironic that you choose to use terrorism tactics on this board yet profess your hatred for it.

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:08 am

Gumby, if you are not Udall you should try to stop sounding like him. It is clear you know VJ very well, so you must be very familiar with Udall’s posts and his style. Do the exact opposite and pull it off long enough and maybe.. just maybe.. I will believe you are not Matt Udall.

CloakingDevice on June 23, 2006 at 1:13 am

“I fail to see the importance in who I am or am not.”
If it was not important to you then you would reveal your identity. Since you have not, that implies you have something to hide. People that have something to hide should not ask for trust. Your stories and accusations would be given credibility if you would identify yourself. Otherwise, how could any kind of discussion really take place.
You come to us with accusations and no evidence and try to steer this forum into something it is not supposed to be. Do you object to having the pictures removed from this site?

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:13 am

Merc you and I obviously don’t speak the same language. Yes there were statements about legal action. There’s a thread in the site discussion area and Ewok is looking into it. I stated that this would never fly and he’d do little more than request to have the pictures and timeline info removed because he doens’t want to find himself in a huge legal battle where everything comes out in the open.
But that’s not all that you guys on VJ did. You’re sitting there, a lynch mob at the ready (and boy VJ sure is good at that) just chomping at the bit to tear apart Debbie for her opinion. You say what she did was low? Well is it not just as low to post pictures of her that mock her and then make defamatory statements about her and to ice the cake, publicly state that your (not you but charlesnessa) is looking into her age, etc in order to see if he has her phone number and then call her and give her crap about this? That kiddies is malicious intent and can be prosecuted where as you can’t litigate Debbie for an opinion.
And I have every right to state what I’ve stated and have backed it up. Who I am is of no importance. If your so riled up about protecting VJ then why not know the truth about who runs it and why and why not take some responsibility for protecting yourselfs from UPL. Because when push comes to shove, aint Steve or no one else running that site gonna protect you.

Gumby on June 23, 2006 at 1:15 am

“And those people responsible for alienating an lawyer who was only trying to help those genuinely seeking to immigrate to the US should be the ones who face litigation. And Iíll do whatever I can to help.”
Finally the truth comes out. Was it that hard? How long has it been, really? Isn’t it time to let this go and allow the people of that forum to live in peace. You don’t see anyone complaining.
It is disgusting that your motivation for posting was solely for the purpose of vengenence against VJ. I just don’t understand the depth of your beef and why you insist on lurking on the site and carrying out these actions. Surely there must be a better outlet for your energy than this.
This issue is about photos on this site and the misuse thereof.
The photos should be removed. For the sake of the women involved I hope you agree. The request is reasonable given the circumstances.

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:18 am

“There is no purpose in such a comment other than to incite anger.”
Was I “inciting anger” here? Maybe you’re right…. I forgot that they are very short-tempered out there (maybe its the desert heat). Silly me, how could I forget their violent reactions to the cartoons and other trivial issues?

anonymous twit on June 23, 2006 at 1:19 am

Oh man you had to bring up the cartoons. Touche, what can I say?

CloakingDevice on June 23, 2006 at 1:21 am

“Merc you and I obviously don’t speak the same language”
Finally we agree…..my intent is to get these photos removed for my sisters. Your intent is to profess your hatred of VJ and it’s prior owners over some beef about a lawyer that got ejected a very long time ago.
We are speaking a different language.
I’m not here to defend actions taken back on VJ for things that are posted. I am only asking for photos to be removed. Simple request really that has nothing to do with Steve or the past VJ regime.
You’re the only one that keeps bringing that up. I’m defending these girls and their honor. You are taking that as defending VJ.
We can debate that separately, but for now I’d like you to join me in asking Debbie to take these pictures down.

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:25 am

Do I object to having pictures removed from this blog? No, not in principle. She posted images that were copyrighted on another message board and she cut and pasted without permission of the board. Big deal. I see far too much of that on VJ as it is. I canít even count the number of times Iíve seen information posted with no credit given to who ever authored it or the website it was pulled from.
So Debbie removes the pictures and timeline info (and really, how stupid is that to post that info publicly anywhere. People on VJ will never learn). And her words are still there. Her statements are still there. Her opinion will still remain the same.
I donít see why anyone gets so upset unless thereís some truth in her words? If it makes these women think twice then that canít possibly be a bad thing now can it. All one has to do is go and read JenPrincessí thread and thatís reason enough to reevaluate the relationship. And thatís not a bad thing to do in a time when all these radicals have a ñ to quote someone on VJ- serious ìhate onî for Americans.
Or would you rather we open our borders to anyone and everyone? Why not scrutinize these men and these relationships as thoroughly as possible so as to avoid another 9/11?
And for the love of god I am not Mr. Udall. I am just someone who was very sorry to see him run off the site the way he was and even sorrier to see all too much misinformation being posted on a website thatís supposed to be devoted to education and information. But apparently some folks out there fancy themselves lawyers and immigration experts

Gumby on June 23, 2006 at 1:25 am

“apparently some folks out there fancy themselves lawyers and immigration experts”
OK….I’m seriously trying to understand why you are so upset with VJ.
From what I gather so far…..you were friends (I guess?) with the lawyer that was booted. You thought he gave good advice and was trying to help people. OK…fair enough.
Now you believe that people are on the site attempting to be lawyers and immigration experts.
OK that means you are visiting the site. Do you have an example (again, I’m trying to understand this better) of where this is happening or who is doing it?

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:32 am

“I donít see why anyone gets so upset unless thereís some truth in her words?”
BTW – I’m upset because these are good people and my friends. I have no ties or affiliations to anything in the Middle East. My only interest is in the people that are on the board and their well being. The reason for getting upset was the unauthorized posting of photos with those terribly insulting captions. She can say what she wants but take the pics off.
You said you have been through this process….where is your SO from? Wouldn’t you be upset if you were in this position?

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:36 am

merc, don’t ask for examples of UPL. VJ and britishexpats.com are full of them.
Actually, britishexpats.com is a much worse offender in that regard.

CloakingDevice on June 23, 2006 at 1:39 am

“merc, don’t ask for examples of UPL”
why? like I said….I’m trying to understand the outrage here….that’s all
You have to admit, gumby is pretty p/o. There has to be some good reason for that.
I’m not an unreasonable person. Proof of the claim is fair in my opinion.

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:44 am

merc, it detracts from what you’re trying to accomplish. The pictures. The pictures. UPL can wait.

CloakingDevice on June 23, 2006 at 1:45 am

“merc, it detracts from what you’re trying to accomplish. The pictures. The pictures. UPL can wait”
Agreed, but it seems Ms. Schlussel has no intention thus far. Certainly there has been plenty of time to remove these pictures. I think that really speaks volumes about a person’s character to be honest.
Please Ms. Schlussel, remove the photos.

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:48 am

Maybe someone should post about this on Kos? They’d love to beat up on a wingnut like debbie.

CloakingDevice on June 23, 2006 at 1:49 am

Left wing, right wing…..I think all reasonable people would agree this was wrong. There is an opportunity to do some correction and at least make a gesture by taking these photos down.

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:51 am

Put yourself in her shoes. Why would you, after all this?

CloakingDevice on June 23, 2006 at 1:54 am

I notice that none of those “VJ” women who married and immigrated their men on K-1 visas, which provides a 2 year “conditional” visa, have yet reached their 2 year date for the filing of the removal of conditions. This (with some exceptions) requires both husband and wife to file together; if application is approved, husband is awarded his permanent green card.
CIS could probably staff a dedicated phone line to take all the bewildered phone calls from US citizen spouses whose suddenly departed spouse decided to leave, or whose attitude and personality changed dramatically after the 2 yr date, followed by arguments, fights, departure or divorce following a seemingly idyllic relationship. Or the angry calls from spouses whose pride has been hurt, who believe the authorities can just rush right in and deport their wandering hubby, only to find it’s too late; papers were filed and approved; spuse is here permanently, thanks.
To be fair, I am not only speaking solely of Middle Eastern men, though marrying a citizen is an easier and faster way for any intending genuine immigrant or fraudster with no other way to enter the US – happens just as frequently with other nationalities, a few more frequently than others, where there are virtual industries catering to poor, desperate, would-be immigrants and are made aware the ticket to the US can be fast-tracked though a quickie courtship and marriage, much of it lacking any serious personal interaction before the marriage to a US citizen, and bank on the US citizens almost certain naivite.
Nor are scenarios like these the rule rather than the exception, but the fact is, there are people out there who know how to play the game, and are people who teach others how to play the game to obtain a coveted and prized US green card, and play it well, no matter the harm to the naive citizen spouse. These unpleasant scenarios happen, just watch out.

LSmith on June 23, 2006 at 1:57 am

“Put yourself in her shoes. Why would you, after all this?”
Anyone that professes to be a person of faith is obligated by the duty to do right. To do otherwise is to insult your religion and mock it’s meaning in your own life.
That is my feeling on this matter. Call it what you will.

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 1:58 am

Merc you do love to hear yourself talk, donít you?
I get it, youíre out to protect the little women on VJ who canít protect themselves whoíve been called fat and unattractive and due to their low self esteem are targets for unsavory type men from the middle east. I get it already.
Ok so, Debbie takes the photos down, then what? Still going to circle the wagons and throw a rope over the old oak tree? What will satisfy you?
Itís really been interesting to see you all turn on one another out there. Quite the cat-fight going on.
I donít have a hate-on for VJ. I do have problems with the site and many others like it being used to give advice when those proffering the advice are neither educated or or authorized to give it. And whom are these people you ask? Good lord man, are you blind? All you have to do is read posts from some of VJís more prolific posters, Arijit/Agent Smith, Diadromous Mermaid, Meauxna, Yodrak, Auusiewench, etc to see for yourself how these folks give case-specific advice in some of the most complicated scenarios. And itís the same over at British Expats. At least, as I stated before they werenít able to run off Mr. Udall and Mr. Folinksy from British Expats.
Sassycat, Bopeep and Gemmacat were also notorious for playing ìarmchair lawyersî. Itís a good thing those women donít post anymore. They were a danger to the community, not to mention made other people feel left out and not part of said community. And their still at it. All you have to do is read Bopeeps blog and does she go on about how they still get together. http://www.ameribritbaby.blogspot.com And if she posts another picture of her fat baby Iíll just kill myself. That child is neither cute, pretty or even remotely attractive and her mom needs to realize that. Some babies just arenít pretty. Hopefully sheíll be smart to make up for being such an obese child. But then if sheís like her mom, thereís really no hope for her.
Hey, thatís a good example. People need to be careful about posting their pictures on the web be it babies or couples. It opens you up to scrutiny and comments, be they negative or positive. I think this is a lesson learned on all sides.

Gumby on June 23, 2006 at 1:59 am

“Merc you do love to hear yourself talk, don?t you? ”
You can beat me up, I don’t mind at all. Although, please keep in mind that you are enabling the continuation of this conversation to a great extent so it goes both ways.
“etc to see for yourself how these folks give case-specific advice in some of the most complicated scenarios.”
I can’t tell you how many times those people have said to contact an immigration attorney so I’m not sure that is totally fair.
What is your problem with people offering a description of their experience with immigration. I asked a lot of stupid noob type questions in the beginning. How is any of this harming individuals and if it is happening then why doesn’t anyone hear about it?
I think your claim on VJ is a little off. I heard stories about those old days and people are very careful to say “contact and immigration attorney”. It happens all the time.
Were you burned by someone? Is that why you get so angry about people giving advice?

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 2:09 am

“Were you burned by someone? Is that why you get so angry about people giving advice?”
No. VJ makes it less likely people will need the services of charlatans like him. You know which attorneys end up with practices based solely on immigration law? The ones that graduate at the bottom of their classes. The scum at the bottle of the attorney pool.

CloakingDevice on June 23, 2006 at 2:15 am

Really? And where are your statistics to back up your statement about attorneys who graduate at the bottom of their class practising immigration law?
That’s quite the generalization you’ve got going.
It’s all good though. People can just go on posting on sites like VJ, British Expats and the rest about what exactly to do to get someone into the country and years from now we’ll still be dealing with terrorists and extremists from radical Islamic nations wanting to tear down our country and destroy all we hold dear.
And this is just an assumption on my part, but I believe Mr. Udall is based in California and I doubt he wants to take immigration aid websites down because they detract from his business. He’s in the land of the illegals after all, I’m sure he’s got plenty to keep him busy. But I bet he and many others like him tire of having to clean up the mess left behind by people who took the advice they got on VJ or other websites and it caused problems, delays, RFE’s and the like.

Gumby on June 23, 2006 at 2:27 am

“But I bet he and many others like him tire of having to clean up the mess left behind by people who took the advice they got on VJ or other websites and it caused problems, delays, RFE’s and the like. ”
Wouldn’t that create more business for him? That argument is a little suspect, you’d have to admit.
So….your beef with VJ and other sites is that it enables terrorists to get into the country? What if those people used a lawyer instead of VJ? Are lawyers screening their clients to deter terrorism? I think that argument is suspect as well.
Your beef lies elswhere because those reasons quite frankly do not make sense to me.
It’s a shame you still do not wish to identify yourself.
If nothing else we have proven that you cannot possibly be a lawyer. You’d probably be happy if VJ was shut down….the question is why? I believe that is still unanswered. You must have something to gain in that scenario or you have a geniune dislike for the people involved. Hmmm….two sites though? That’s a pretty big beef you’ve got going there.
One question:
You said you know this system inside and out. I take it that means you went through this process. Did you use an immigration attorney?

mercuryroad on June 23, 2006 at 2:55 am

You chicks are a dime a dozen. If you’re not throwing Bibles at people or picketing abortion clinics or funerals of fallen soldiers shouting they deserve to die, then you’re sitting on your lazy backsides searching the internet for people you don’t have any clue about to attack, and it’s normally because of some miserable aspect of your own personal lives. What’s the matter, Deb? Did you realize the man you gave a lap dance too one night and who rescued you from your life of misery only married you to cook his dinner while he clicks his remote control or tells you he’s out playing cards with Joe when really he’s letting little Candy girl do exactly what you did for him before he gave your pitiful self a ring? ….Or, did you meet your better half at a KKK rally? …Or, maybe even in the front pew of a church while you were raising your hands to the heavens and speaking in tongues? Did he say to himself, “Now there is a gullible one. I can marry her, slap her around a few times, get her to wash my clothes, pop out my babies, maybe even mow my lawn, and I can keep on doing what I’m doing right now.”
Not that it’s any business of yours, but I have known my fiance for 3 years, for 1 year before I went to meet him, and then divorced the sorry American I was married to for too many years. If it was possible, after he’s here and we’re married long past the time you’re into your third divorce, I’d send you a sympathy card, but then , that would make me just like you, and since I’m not, this will be the only time you ever hear from me. Instead of judging others you don’t know, keep an eye on your kids while their sneaking around smoking dope or doing things they swear to you they never do and you’re buying it all. You have your own life. Try to live it. We’ll be happy with ours whether you like it or not. I would say that most American men I have met are not worthy of me, and believe me I could have had my choices, but that would be judging all by just a handful of jerks and that’s what you do. I searched myself and found my decent and honorable man. He didn’t search and find me. The small percentage of Muslim extremists who search to meet American women are so small it’s laughable and certainly not worthy of the time in a blog, just as the small percentage of idiots like you are laughable, but I was certainly happy to take these 2 minutes with my coffee here before I forget all about you and tell you I feel so very sorry for you. Have a nice life, if you can. Ciao.

Ginger727 on June 23, 2006 at 5:54 am

“oh come on now Canadian Infidel, those women she openly mocks did not agree to be part of an article. She is certainly free to say what she wants, but a respected journalist/blogger sticks to facts and does not prey on people to get a point across.”
But these people are a part of the article because they are members of Visa Journey and represent just what the point of the opinion piece was about. And is showing pictures and time lines mocking? No, visuals add to the story to make it more comprehensible. Now if you mean the word zaftig, whats wrong with it? It means pleasantly plump, juicy, a well developed figure, or carrying your extra weight well. Is the word used improperly? Looking at some of the pictures I would say no, and it is clarified that many, not all of these woman are zaftig. Are the facts wrong? Well, I have seen no real clarification on that matter in the above thread, just anger and hurt feelings for having pictures and personal experiences used without the persons permission. But permission is not needed as you have openly posted to the public domain, and false credit or misrepresentation of the pictures and time lines has not been taken for they all correspond with the information posted on the Visa Journey web site.
‘…and I have yet to see any kind of slander or bigotry from the host of this site.’
“Did you read the article or did you just read the comments and decided to put in your 2 cents worth?”
I read it. I think it is you would have not, or read it in the throws of hysteria. They say the truth hurts, could this be an instance?

Canadian Infidel on June 23, 2006 at 8:42 am

I have to say that this blog just makes me laugh and mad at the same time. It is people like you that are making our country more racist than it is right now. So you know any men from these countries? I seriously doubt it by the comments you make. You are an attorney? Obvious not a very good one to not know the copyright laws eh? You can go off about american women and arab men till you are blue in the face. Now regarding this girl, does she not have parents to realise she was off to the middle east? Someone needs to take some responsiblity in this matter which is NOT the happily married women with our wonderful arab men.

twogems on June 23, 2006 at 1:09 pm

mercuryLoad;debbie pissed off the religion of hate na na na na na na.

danny on June 23, 2006 at 1:10 pm

Whatever side of this argumnet your on, everyone should admit that Debbie does bring up sone points that are based in fact.There are people who r defrauding women to get here. Everyone should take that with a grain of salt and instead of thinking its not your relationship, look thru with impartial eyes.
The pictures and insults, are not cool tho,at all.

hrmmm1234 on June 23, 2006 at 2:40 pm