How were the Muslims the victims on the Titanic?

Occam's Tool on April 16, 2012 at 3:09 pm

Say I’m crazy but when I first read about this I thought it sank because they said “even G-d couldn’t sink her”. Well He did.

Hollywood on April 16, 2012 at 3:34 pm

This women recalling her aunts story just happens to be muslim. Shes not or is anyone saying muslims are the real victims. Debbie just sees muslims as less than human and have no right to be heard, sheesh, you are low

Tim on April 16, 2012 at 3:38 pm

Tim, Ms. Schlussel is not a hater. She is pointing out the nonsense perpetrated by some Muslims. YOUR “victim” ploy is painfully obvious.

Hollywood on April 16, 2012 at 3:41 pm

Wish I hadn’t seen Titanic. Believe me my future wife Debbie, you missed being bored to death for about 3 hours.

Cameron makes the same movie over and over. His only talent is making movies look like epics. But, you can sum up every single plot as “Corporations are evil.” Every single movie is about an evil corporation. Terminator, Aliens, Avatar, and Titanic. Titanic at least added all rich people as evil for a twist.

Cameron is a hack. And, a hypocrite since he’s part of the evil rich.

Jeff_W on April 16, 2012 at 3:42 pm

Titanic sinking was a world-changing event at the time. It was the end of the Gilded Age. 1500 people died. But more importantly at the time, it was the world’s most luxurious ship and it carried a passenger list that was a Who’s Who of American and European wealth. Imagine today if a ship sank carrying Donald Trump and Bill Gates, maybe a few sports stars and movie stars. It would impact us. Maybe not you. Maybe not me. But it would impact the country.

Also remember that it was long believed that the Titanic was too deep to be found. Ballard’s 1985 dive on the wreck brought it back to our imagination. Cameron’s film cemented it there. It’s not a bad movie, Debbie. It captures the elegance of the vessel and the humanity of the tragedy quite well. Sure it’s a cliché romance but it’s set against an amazing background. And there are some fabulous scenes. Finally, class warfare was a real thing then. This was the era of robber barons.

Fleiter on April 16, 2012 at 4:04 pm

There was some special on yesterday about more studies about how the Titanic sank, and I channel-surfed past it when they were testing mock-ups of the riveted metal like the actualconstruction of the ship. My son saw that and said “why are they even doing that? It hit an iceberg and sank! They even said nobody uses rivets anymore, so what are they doing?” Ahhh sometimes youth CAN exhibit wisdom. Thank you, son. Click. Next channel.

Sean M on April 16, 2012 at 4:10 pm

Hollywood, the women is one of many who are making the titanic thing go on and on. You have reenactment cruises and what not going on now with victims relatives retelling the stories. This woman just happens to have a muslim name, so what, why point it out and say her relatives story is less than those of others? I dont see anywhere in the article that she mentions it was because she was muslim

Tim on April 16, 2012 at 4:15 pm

I don’t know Tim, it’s the first I ever heard about any Arabs on the ship & I did reports on it and studied it for years. You & I both know DS is correct. Next we’ll see CAIR wanting a special proclamation for the contributions of the Muslims on the Titanic.

Hollywood on April 16, 2012 at 4:18 pm

@Hollywood
“Schlussel is not a hater” are you fking kidding me? so you are saying she is fair and balance? ohh please, it is one thing that you believe on what she is saying and it is completely another thing when you try to defend her.

sam on April 16, 2012 at 4:20 pm

The story was silly, but I liked some aspects of the movie.

David on April 16, 2012 at 4:25 pm

It’s the 100th anniversary of the word “jazz.”

I contributed a lot to the research of this word origin. I’ve begged everyone from jazz musician Wynton Marsalis (who collaborated on Ken Burns’ PBS “Jazz” documentary) to the Los Angeles Times (where the article appeared on April 2, 1912) to honor the anniversary. No one was kind enough to respond.

The Titanic is a story that everyone knows. “Jazz” is a story that no one knows, and I suppose no one ever will. So much for honoring a great American word and musical form.

Honoring the 100th anniversary of “jazz” is not a favor to me, but I’m very ill right now and I’ll never forget that no one in our mainstream media was even kind enough to respond.

Barry Popik on April 16, 2012 at 4:44 pm

Well, the Iceberg Lettuce industry is probably happy about what’s going on.

I, too, find irritating all the hoopla about the Titanic’s sinking. But the Muslim woman from Detroit is identifying much of the reason there is so much publicity about the Titanic. The thing that the leftist news media finds attractive about the anniversary of the Titanic’s sinking is that there were lots of VICTIMS.

Granted, these victims can’t easily be identified with the evil 1@, or capitalist white males, but they are still victims. The 100th anniversary commemoration will help get all of us in the habit of being sympathetic to victims in general. You can be sure the next victims the press celebrates will be women or blacks or Arabs, etc.

Even though the left usually uses a sledgehammer, they are sometimes capable of subtlety. This is one of those times.

Little Al on April 16, 2012 at 5:28 pm

So many stories, old and new, have been uncovered about the Titanic. The drama in the Jewish community played out in a different manner.

The best-known American Orthodox Jew of that second decade of the 20th century was Cantor Yossele Rosenblatt.

He acted instinctively with the great heart he had. For RCA Victor Records he cut an El Mole Rahamim for the unfortunate ones who were gone. You can pick it up easily on the internet by putting in his name. 100 years later we listen to Rosenblatt’s moving melodic musical interpretation. For his prayer he included in Hebrew, something new for that period, “for the people of the Titanic who drowned in the sea and are gone to their eternal home.”

That recording sold quickly – $150,000 was raised because Rosenblatt donated all his rights. Those funds, a very large sum, was contributed to the fund for the families who lost loved ones on the Titanic.

As the selfless act of love and devotion of Ida Straus, dying together with her husband Isidor(co-founder of Macys), became better known, both Jews and Christians praised her to the sky. She was a woman of valor – following the words of Ruth to Naomi, “where you die – I will die.”

True love, if ever…..

Debbie with her finger on the movie pulse will no doubt be reviewing the following movie to be released in early May.

Follow Me, the Yoni Netanyahu Story.
http://trailers.apple.com/trailers/independent/followme/

After the slaughtering of the Jewish athletes at the Munich Olympics 1972 and then the Entebbe Raid 1976, will there ever be a time for peace.

Eyes Wide Open on April 16, 2012 at 8:17 pm

It is a stale story told too many times. The Titanic was an early twentieth century cruise liner, and not some lost library of palace of the ancients. It was the “Love Boat” of its day albeit the third class passengers just used it as transportation.

Worry01 on April 16, 2012 at 8:24 pm

Count me as one more person who thinks that the “Titanic” story has been overblown.

JeffE on April 16, 2012 at 10:07 pm

Meh, I liked the movie. It was the background of one of the nicest first dates I ever went on. Plus, its just interesting. Perhaps it appeals to people because we always wonder how we would react were we to find ourselves in tragic circumstances. For example, I know that had I been alive and on the Titanic, I would have been 3rd class and died. But would I have died with dignity, or screaming like a wienie? I would hope the former.

Matt on April 16, 2012 at 10:22 pm

The movie promotes the class warfare, with lies. An example from an excellent article on the subject:

The Hollywood narrative makes for good entertainment. But it ignores the fact that many of the Titanic’s first-class passengers — the “1 percenters” of their day — voluntarily went down aborad the ship so that women and children could get aboard lifeboats.

Consider first-class passenger Benjamin Guggenheim, 46, the scion of the Guggenheim fortune. As ice-cold water flooded through a gash in the ship’s hull, he was overhead to say that he and other social elites had “dressed up in our best and are prepared to go down like gentlemen.”

He passed along a message to a survivor, stating: “Tell my wife, if it should happen that my secretary and I both go down, tell her I played the game out straight to the end. No woman shall be left aboard this ship because Ben Guggenheim was a coward.”

Among other rich and famous passengers who died: American John Jacob Astor IV; Irish businessman Thomas Andrews (who oversaw the ship’s construction); and American owner of the Macy’s department store, Isidor Straus, and his wife Ida.

Of the Titanic’s approximately 2,223 passengers and crew, about 1,517 perished – and 706 survived. The ship’s 20 lifeboats could only carry one third of the people on board.

For Titanic aficionados with a leftist agenda, the numbers and percentages of passengers who got to the lifeboats — their sexes and social classes — can be crunched to prove just about whatever one wants.

“The reality of class, selfishness, and altruism in the disaster is more ambiguous,” observes Edward Tenner in his article “Titanic and the 1%” published by the American Enterprise Institute.

“As Titanic scholars acknowledge, the survival rate of passengers depended in part on proximity to the boat deck. So it is no wonder that nearly all the women and children in first class were saved. Conversely, complex passageways and language barriers further delayed evacuation of third-class passengers. In all classes, as the literary scholar Stephen Cox has underscored in an essay and an excellent book, moral choices cut across social lines.

“Individual responses aside, there are surprises in the statistics. For example, women in third class were significantly more likely to survive than first-class men: 46 versus 33 percent.”

He adds: “The most surprising and least known statistic is that nearly twice as many third-class as second-class men survived – 16 percent versus 8 percent – despite the greater distance of the former from the boats. Were the second-class men the most dutiful and chivalrous of all, the true unsung heroes of the tragedy? Were the third-class men simply younger and more vigorous? Or were the second-class men the middle managers of the era, either fatally deferential to the upper crust or disfavored, consciously or not, by snobbish stewards? In any case, a larger proportion of the dogs on the Titanic survived, 4 out of 13, than second-class men.”

How come the chivalry of Titanic’s richest passengers failed to get proper attention in the “Titanic” movie? Because today no one would believe the truth; so says Cuban-born author and historian Luis E. Aguilar in his essay “The Titanic and The Decline of Western Ethnic.”

ender on April 16, 2012 at 10:27 pm

“And, yet, an amateur named Noah built his (albeit, with the guidance of G-d), and his floated, enduring not just an iceberg, but a worldwide tsunami of a flood.”

Sorry, but regardless of whatever you might think of the movie “The Titanic,” I believe that most folks would agree that it was better than “Evan Almighty” (which I haven’t seen. I’ve only seen one Tom Shadyak movie, and afterwords, vowed that I would never waste any time and money on another).

Irving on April 17, 2012 at 12:34 am

The “chivalry” of the rich was for their own. There were not enough lifeboats because the owners of the ship, White Star Lines, believed it was unsinkable so there was no real need. The design of the ship called for the hull to be compartmentalized so that if a gash was created only that section would fill and could be isolated. I don’t remember what the analysis of the plans showed but there was a massive fail of this system.
As for third class passengers not getting into the life boats, there may have been some shooting which would have been self defense to keep panickers from swamping the boats trying to launch. In a shipwreck, it is critical to get the life boats as far from the main ship as fast as possible or they will bet sucked down with the main ship.
However, the gangways leading from the “steerage” decks which were below the water line, were blocked by locked grills to prevent the “riff raff” from sneaking up to the upper decks and mingling with, or robbing, the wealthy. If anyone even thought about these unfortunate souls, no one bothered to go below and open the gates.
Ender is quite right with his list of notables who perished and these were not simply wealthy people, they were the movers and shakers of the time, far more significant in the life of the Nation that the examples Fleiter offers.

Italkit on April 17, 2012 at 2:43 am

This has been the funniest thing I’ve read on the Titanic http://thepeoplescube.com/peoples-blog/1912-titanic-disaster-was-racism-to-blame-t8819.html

MarkSWFL on April 17, 2012 at 3:06 am

I also thought I was the only one who felt that way. Of course we all know that the Muslim presence has been “everywhere” from discovering America, don’t tell Columbus or Vespucci that, to being the “first man” in space. I am tired of all the stupidity and the fact that our president wants us to make these people feel good. Debbie, an excellent article and you are right. Little or nothing will be said about the 1972 massacre of the Israeli athletes or even Entebbe. We are so interested in hype that we have forgotten the real issues. How sad and yes, frightening.

Naomi R on April 17, 2012 at 1:52 pm

I recall that at the time, Mad magazine did an absolutely hilarious issue on the movie itself, and rebutted people complaining about their insensitivity to the victims of the tragedy. It was a riot to read 😉

I watched that movie and agree w/ everybody here – boy, was that boring! And it ran for 3 hrs at a stretch! I did however like the special effects of that movie.

Infidel on April 17, 2012 at 2:50 pm

I believe it was stated that the Titanic could sail with any four of its sixteen compartments breached. The iceberg breached five.

luagha on April 17, 2012 at 5:11 pm

You are mistaken on so many levels, I don’t even know where to begin. I would not lash out, however, because a) you’re entitled to your views and b) some people thrive off puerile name-calling in an attempt to garner attention.

A few points:

First, nowhere in this article you linked does it say Muslims were the real victims. It was simply a relative of a Titanic victim recalling her. Sure, some were not mentioned, Muslims included, but then again, so were most of the 3rd class passengers. Only prominent names, 1st class passengers, were constantly mentioned. But clearly you have this weird fixation on trying to link everything to Muslims. I’m surprised you didn’t blame the sinking on Islamic terrorists. Ha-ha.

Second, it’s not just any anniversary, it’s the centennial anniversary. It is a time to reflect on the tragedy that unfolded in the Atlantic. This is, however, not the main point.

The main significance, which is my third point, is not, as you postulate, the Titanic’s conception of classism or its promulgation as the catalyst of this tragedy. The tragedy lies in the loss, the victims themselves, many of whom were women and children, all due to shortage of boats. (It was actually legal, for her size, to carry that capacity of boats at the time). These victims didn’t just die; either by drowning or, even worse, painful hypothermia from the cold water.

Was there classism in this? Well, percentage wise, first class passengers had the greatest survival percentage, whereas it was the opposite with third class passengers and crew, but, and I understand this concept is foreign to you, correlation does not always equal causation. (First class passengers were put on boats first to ‘streamline’ the evacuation process. First class cabins were closest to the boat deck, whereas third class passengers were fathoms below in steerage. It was simply an organized and ostensibly efficient approach at the time, but I digress.) Beyond class, the tragedy is paramount.

And it’s funny how you made the comparison to conclude that Noah’s ark was superior. I mean, did it hit an iceberg? Or make any collisions? I doubt it. Maybe we should send marine engineers and architects to examine the ark! Oh, wait.. ha-ha. Assuming it existed, the basic structure, like any ship or boat, was supported by the hull. No matter how elevated a water is, a sound hull keeps it afloat. Also, none of the lifeboats from the Titanic drowned. Can we conclude, from that, that lifeboats are structurally superior to the Titanic?

Finally, your racial fixation to include Muslim in the topic of this piece, where your talk voluminously about how little you care about Titanic, is nothing short of perplexing.

But since you’re racially fixated, let me go off-topic here and state that I am actually Arab. I’m agnostic because all three Abrahamic religion’s extreme followers embody the same hypocritical idea that “we hate [them] and we need to target them because, unlike them, we are taught love and peace.” Anyone see the irony in this? They all embrace the same principles. I can’t wait to see how all of my above points will be ignored to address my race, but hey, you guys are not racist, nosireebob!

P.S. notice how I didn’t mention the movie because, apart from the historical and factual inaccuracies in it, it capitalised on this tragedy on her 100th anniversary.

God bless you all. 🙂

Titanic enthusiast on April 17, 2012 at 8:52 pm

Thank God I didn’t see this movie.

BethesdaDog on April 18, 2012 at 10:32 pm

wahahah Noah? Great myth ya got there hun….ass

Howard Silver on April 20, 2012 at 6:03 pm

Debbie u r a cake… You hate Muslims for absoultely no reason, we did not bomb the world twin towers u bitch, it was done by your American government, google it u dumb slut. You talk about few stinking athlete jews who got killed at the olympics, what about the thousands of Palestinian muslims being killed by Jews these past few years, have you no heart??? Bush went to war with Afghanistan and Iraq, not cos Muslims r bad people, but for the oil, how many American soldiers got killed for Bush n his regime? Do u not c your government is corrupt??? N u can not blame the Iraqis n Afghanistan for defending their lands, if a guy comes in my yard n demands to take over, I will kill him myself to protect my family and my property… U r a hater, I think u shud watch the titanic instead of watching n belvng whatevr u see on Cnn, do your research u dumb whore, and u will find that Muslims r not bad people. I do not hate anybody, n I truly feel sorry not only for the Muslims who passed away on the Titanic, but everybody who did. I feel sorry for the families n victims of 9.11 too, how cud your own government blind them like that. I feel sorry for your soldiers who died in Iraq n Afghanistan going behind the words of the government, while the President himself is happy with his family… Think u dumb whore, Bush said that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction, they found nothing, n yet went on with the war, how fucken gullable can u b???

Realist on November 23, 2013 at 10:22 am