Most states outlawed affirmative action. Unfortunately, its still federal government policy.

There should no longer be a need to treat minorities on a preferential basis. But state-mandated racism has taken on a life of its own and if I had to guess, the Supreme Court will dodge the issue.

After all minorities (and women) are politically correct and no one challenges their entitlements, whether or not they are still justified. I don’t expect the status quo to change in my lifetime.

NF: Sadly, most states have NOT outlawed affirmative action. Just a handful. I was the general counsel of the Michigan Civil Rights Initiative, outlawing it here in Michigan. And despite passing overwhelmingly, it’s been overturned by the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Sixth Circuit, and is now being appealed. DS

NormanF on February 28, 2012 at 4:08 pm

Rhetoric triumphs again. It is called “affirmative” action rather than “deformative” action, which is really what it is. The liberals win again rhetorically.

Does anyone know anything about political screening of undergraduate admissions? Affirmative action is bad enough, but I suspect there is political screening against conservatives as well. Such screening on the graduate and professional school level is well know, but I don’t know too much about undergraduate screening.

Little Al on February 28, 2012 at 5:04 pm

We also need to get the foot-baths out of Michigan colleges!!!

Hollywood on February 28, 2012 at 5:10 pm

It is amazing that the Sick Circuit basically ruled that treating everyone equally is unconstitutional. and is unequal treatment. Even George Orwell could not have imagined such a perverted twisting of the law, even in his books “1984” and “Animal Farm.”

There is another affirmative action group: Hollywood stars, and their children. No matter how dumb these kids are, they get into Ivy League schools. Same with politician’s kids and newscaster’s children. That is why these people favor affirmative action — they are not affected.

Jonathan E. Grant on February 28, 2012 at 5:14 pm

Well said Debbie, I happen to be a black person myself and I’m against affirmative action, you should do what everybody else in the world does, use you’re intelligence that god gave, NEVER use you’re skin color as a weapon to get ahead of yourself in life.

And if I marry a black female, her and I will teach our kids to things the right way as you’re friend Diedre did DS, and to NOT intimidate, shakedown people, organizations, companies, business, etc. like what Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, etc. have been doing all of these years and decades and making a pathetic image of us black people look like race-merchants. And at the sametime, I’m pretty aware and alert which type of friends I befriend with based on their attitudes and behavior!

“A nation is defined by its borders, language & culture!”

Sean R. on February 28, 2012 at 5:15 pm

Waiting for Gerald

madman on February 28, 2012 at 5:26 pm

I oppose Affirmative Action. That being said, both my kids, who are adopted kids of a Jewish Mensan MD, are Mayan Indians from Guatemala. Hispanic and Native American. My daughter wants to be a Veterinarian, and I will let her use any advantage she has, as the competition for this is harder than Medical School. I think it’s crap, but I know full well of a time when Jewish kids got blocked.

All that being said, the little girl is going to get in the same way other celebrity kids get in. AA won’t play the role; it will be icing on the cake. Daddy and Mommy can donate.

Occam's Tool on February 28, 2012 at 5:27 pm

I should note that many Asians are very unhappy about affirmative action, because they are not only not considered a minority, but only to the effect that their minority status counts against them.

Let me give an example. At University of California, Berzerkely, the admissions department compares SAT scores within each group. For example. let us base this on the old SAT scores that went from 200 to 1600. In the Asian group, the average Asian applicant, or average Asian may have an SAT score of 1400. Now, if an applicant with a score of 1200 applies, he won’t get in.

In the “White” group. the average SAT score may be 1200, so any white person with a score under 1200 won’t get in. If he has a score of 1300, the white person will be admitted, whereas if he was Asian, he would not be.

Now, in the “Black” group, the average SAT score may be 925, so if a black person applies with a score of 980, they will be admitted, while whites and asians with that same or better score, but under 1200 and 1400 respectfully would not be admitted.

Why was this system set up? Marian Berry, former head of the Civil Rights Commission complained that if there wasn’t affirmative action, the colleges would only have Asian and Jewish students! (Talk about racist).

And yes, there are civil rights suits ongoing by Asians against universities.

I also agree with Deb’s view that Affirmative Action won’t be struck down.

Jonathan E. Grant on February 28, 2012 at 5:31 pm

I should note that in government, being an Asian/Pacific Islander does help, and to a degree it can help in the private sector.

Jonathan E. Grant on February 28, 2012 at 5:34 pm

Do you know who came up with the idea of affirmative action? Adolph Hitler. He said there were not enough white Christian Germans in medicine, law, the professions, universities, so he banned Jews from practicing any of these professions, or from entering the universities.

Today’s system is nothing more than a somewhat milder version of Hitler’s.

Jonathan E. Grant on February 28, 2012 at 5:42 pm

I am second generation American. My father had to quit school after the seventh grade to work. My mother after the fifth grade. I paid my own way through college getting both bachelor’s and master’s degrees. I also received a teaching credential from U.C.L.A. Graduate School of Education, which at the time was the second best graduate school of education (Stanford 1st) in the country. I could not get one interview for a teaching job in L.A. County because they knew I was a white male (because of my name and because I grew up in Wyoming). They were flying in minorities from New York State (who didn’t even have California credentials) for interviews.
I grew up poorer than most women and minorities, but that didn’t seem to matter. Those idiots in D.C. cater to special interest groups and lobbyists and it will never change.

Norm Shupe on February 28, 2012 at 5:54 pm

Thank you for an excellent post Debbie.

Confederate South on February 28, 2012 at 5:55 pm

Indeed, AA is crap.

Occam's Tool on February 28, 2012 at 6:05 pm

What part of (From section 1 of the 14th amendment) “nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws” is so hard to understand?

I_AM_ME on February 28, 2012 at 6:23 pm

There is a great book that was an eye opener for me when I was FINALLY committed to being a Conservative.

It’s called “Coloring The News”. You can get it for like 1 cents on Amazon (plus shipping and handling) and the first chapter tackles Affirmative Action.

When the book came out of course the ObamaMedia (although not yet Obama but you know what I mean) ignored it. That is such an important clue. If a book is ignored, you KNOW it’s taking on some pretty incendiary things.

Skunky on February 28, 2012 at 6:44 pm

As Debbie noted, the AA Label always taints the credential of any preferred non-white who has it. There will always be some doubt about competence, even if it is unstated. In addition, the people who benefit the most from affirmative action are those who are the least qualified in terms of knowledge, skills, and abilities to hold the positions that they hold. Such people are a drain on any private or public organization, since more often than not their work has to be redone by others, or in some cases done entirely by others. It is an unjust and expensive sham that falsifies achievement, while at the same time discouraging the honest efforts of those who could make it, whether they are minorities or not. The end result is not diversity, but economic and social impoverishment.

Worry on February 28, 2012 at 7:06 pm

The strange thing is, with all of the affirmative action and progrmas in place and all of the emphasis on “diversity”, as a Black man I have experienced the the “T.O.B.’ syndrome for most of my life. For those who don’t know, T.O.B. means “The Only Black”….

*At my large state college where classes ranged from 50-300 people (and is one of the schools sued over its admissions policies), I was T.O.B. in 90% of my classes.
* In nearly every job that I’ve had since graduating from college, I have been T.O.B. in my department, my division, amd many time, the conpany
* At my graduate B-School, I was T.O.B. in 95% of my classes.
* At my first major employer after grad school, a large computer company, once again I was T.O.B in my sales division. And when I was promoted to marketing, once again I was T.O.B. in my department.
* At my present tech company, where we have 200 employees, once again I am T.O.B. employee at the company.

I’m not arguing for or against affirmative action. Hell, I probably was the beneficiary of it a time or two, but all I did was what society (and my parents!) told me to do…study hard, apply to college, then go out and be a productive American citizen. That’s all I can do. I can’t spend useless time debatig how I got accepted here or why I got a certain job…who knows? Only the admissions officers and recruiters know why they admitted cetain people to their schools or why they hired certain peopleto work at their companies. All I can do is try to add value where I am and excel. I know Debbie says that somehow minorities “get a government-imposed, racist, bigoted advantage over your kids at every educational and professional point in their lives.” But from my perspective as being “T.O.B” in classes at two higher education institutions and for most of my work life, I don’t see that “advantage” putting many butts in seats at schools or at work…

TOB on February 28, 2012 at 7:41 pm

Too funny. But for a guy whose lived his entire life under the a.a. system, it does still sting. So damn wrong.

samurai on February 28, 2012 at 8:07 pm

A College should have to inform ppl that have been passed over because of race based admissions. A “Dear Whitey” letter if you will.

Brian on February 28, 2012 at 8:27 pm

Debbie, a couple of things. First of all, AA is immoral like a lot of government plots to redistribute resources to favored constituencies. And no doubt Asians and Jews are paying a disproportitiinate price as AA losers. Second, people have been telling me it’s harder to get into vet school than medical school since the late 80’s. I still don’t believe it. The doctors I’ve come across are smarter than most vets, regardless of the rejection rates at any particular school. Ditto for most lawyers (not including the lovely and talented DS who surely could have gone to medical school and married a nice Jewish doctor).

A1 on February 28, 2012 at 8:52 pm

madman:

I am here.

First of all, there was NO REASON to go after Simone Johnson. NONE. It reminds me of how Rush Limbaugh’s bizarre rant about Donovan McNabb years ago: many “conservatives” have hated the guy and rooted for/enjoyed his “failures” ever since, and the guy didn’t do anything to deserve it. Thanks to nonsense like this, the only thing that anyone knows about Simone Johnson is that she is a wealthy multiracial kid who MIGHT get SOMETHING that SOME white person “deserves” SOMEDAY, and that is enough to make people resent her OVER SOMETHING TOTALLY UNRELATED TOA ANYTHING THAT SHE HAS DONE, HAS NO CONTROL OVER, OR IS RESPONSIBLE FOR.

Second, do not confuse me for an affirmative action apologist. That affirmative action is a backwards, counterproductive social and educational policy because it focuses on getting a few kids into elite schools that they probably can’t handle instead of a lot of kids into junior colleges and trade schools is enough to oppose it. I also dislike how it has become an end unto itself rather than a means to a larger goal. So, when the Supreme Court makes it illegal (and I disagree with Ms. Schlussel on this, as it was a 5-4 decision last time authored by Sandra Day O’Connor, who has been replaced with John Roberts, who not only despises affirmative action but has tended towards protecting the rights of people to discriminate) I won’t shed any tears.

But here’s the deal: lots of people who claim to hate affirmative action actually LOVE it. These are the folks who simply bear grudges against “minorities”, so they LOVE affirmative action because the issue gives them a socially acceptable construct to publicly address their grievances. That is why affirmative action gets SO MUCH ATTENTION despite being a marginal policy that only truly effects a miniscule percentage of the population. Meanwhile, other far more serious issues that negatively affect a much larger portion of the population get ignored, especially by comparison.

For example, few minorities benefit from affirmative action in higher education, because the overwhelming majority of minorities – and whites – either do not attend college, and of those who do, the vast majority of the colleges that they attend do not have affirmative action programs because their admissions process are neither competitive or selective. My state, for example, has dozens of colleges, and of those only 4 are selective institutions with competitive admissions. And few minorities benefit from affirmative action in hiring because the vast majority of workplaces do not have affirmative action programs. And of the few minorities that benefit, far fewer whites receive harm, because a white person who is legitimately denied college admissions due to affirmative action simply goes to another college, and a white person who is legitimately denied employment due to affirmative action simply finds another job.

It is A LOT MORE CONVENIENT for folks who are primarily interested in using affirmative action to code their disdain for minorities to talk about how Simone Johnson or Sasha and Malia Obama may make off with some white kid from West Virginia’s college spot one day than it is to deal with (as I stated on another blog that I didn’t have time to get back to) the fact that the unemployment rate for black males with college degrees is higher than it is for white males with high school degrees. Now I am not going to assert that the reason for this is (solely) racism; because the fact that blacks (whether college educated or no) tend to seek employment in high unemployment areas plays a huge role … there are more black college grads seeking employment in Schlussel’s Detroit (12% unemployment) than in South Dakota (4.2% unemployment) for instance. Instead, this is merely PROOF that affirmative action programs aren’t nearly so pervasive – either in helping blacks or “harming” whites – because otherwise these black male achievers (again, college grads, not ex-cons, gangbangers, drug dealers or welfare recipients) wouldn’t have a harder time finding jobs than white male high school grads. ESPECIALLY since THE NUMBER OF BLACK MALES WITH COLLEGE DEGREES ARE SO TINY.

Like this Texas case. The two state schools in Texas that anybody cares about attending? Texas-Austin and Texas A&M. Combined enrollment? 100,000. The population of Texas? 25,674,681! But wait … there’s more. Blacks are 4.6% of the population at Texas, and at A&M it is similar. So, let’s say 10,000 folks. With all due respect to the INDIVIDUALS that didn’t get into Texas-Austin or A&M, I’d say that AT LEAST 25,673,681 Texans can’t really blame affirmative action for keeping them down.

Now of course I am exaggerating (yes, there are other selective schools in Texas, especially private ones, and I am not considering stuff like affirmative action in employment and contracting, and I haven’t taken into account Hispanics) but it honestly, truly is a marginal issue. Folks who claim otherwise are lying. And when the Supreme Court ends affirmative action, the folks whose real animus was never affirmative action but rather disdain for “minorities” will just move onto something else. Those folks will never be happy unless all minorities leave (or are deported) from America en masse. (Truthfully, they won’t be happy even then, but I digress.)

G: The reason I wrote this about Simone Johnson is that there was a long article about her and her parents in a very recent issue of People Magazine. Her parents parade her in public, and therefore, she is public figure and fair game. No-one is “picking” on her, as I haven’t insulted her or attacked her personally. I could have used Will Smith’s kids as an example, but they are all Black and it not multiple minorities. This is about special treatment she will get in just a few short years that others will not get. Even citing all the figures you have, none of them changes the fact that affirmative action is still discrimination in favor of certain races, ethnicities, and gender, and it’s patently unfair, unAmerican, and unconstitutional. DS

Gerald on February 28, 2012 at 8:57 pm

Rush Limbaugh’s question wheather the media is paying Donovan McNabb so much attention because of his abilities or because of the color of his skin is bizarre rant? Did I miss something? All I heard him ask was wheather this averge QB was getting all the accolades from the press because he was black. It’s what color commentators do; yak it up to keep a 1 hour sports event going for 3+ hours.
I never understood why people who constantly bring up and discuss their racial or ethnic differences get offended (at even the slightest hint of negativity, whether real or imagined) when others do.

theShadow on February 29, 2012 at 1:15 am

On the individual level, AA is abjectly racist. Yet, the white poor can marry their daughters into the middle class. The black poor are stuck there forever.

Not “fair”, yet, a lot of family law is equally inequitable to men, to a good purpose however.

Matt Robson on February 29, 2012 at 1:26 am

Gerald,

I oppose AA.

HOWEVER, there are few issues that bring as much hypocracy to the table as AA.

You make some good points. There probably are some bigots who secretly like AA because it gives them a way to discredit minority achievement, and the bigots who don’t secretly like it also use it as a way to discredit minority achievement.

The hypocracy comes into play when AA critics themselves have used or would use cronyism,nepotism,etc to get a job or school slot over better qualified candidates and then turn around and complain about “less qualified” minorities getting a job via AA.

For years I’ve heard conservative talk hosts and callers claiming that white males can’t get hired for police and fire jobs because of AA, but a funny thing, the last time I checked, the overwhelming majority of most police and fire depts are white males.

It’s also worth noting that some black opponents of AA such as Larry Elder and Clarence Thomas are themselves beneficiaries of AA.

Thomas in particular has been a benefiary of AA his whole adult life, all the way from college to the Supreme Court. George HW Bush lied when he said race was not a factor in Thomas’ selection to the court.

Scott on February 29, 2012 at 1:58 am

This is off-topic, but there is one place where I would like to see affirmative action, the Nobel Prize for Literature. I would like to see J.K. Rowling, author of the Harry Potter series, win the Nobel Prize for Literature, because I believe that the assorted Nobel Prize for Literature committees, over the decades, have shown a snooty bias agaist fantasy, science fiction and children’s literature.

Miranda Rose Smith on February 29, 2012 at 3:45 am

This discussion of affirmative action reminded me of a dear friend of mine who died some years ago, may she rest in peace. She worked as a legal secretary in a number of downtown law firms. She was sweet, very intelligent, very hardworking, a fine judge of character, eminently qualified to be an office manager-and Black. I’m sure that at least one of the firms she worked for had affirmative action and would have LOVED to promote her to office manager, but she dressed like a slob, and I believe that’s why she was never offered such a promotion.

Miranda Rose Smith on February 29, 2012 at 4:19 am

This entire post is wholly idiotic.

You just threw a 10 year old under the bus, and FOR WHAT! To make a point that could’ve been made without using a child as a verbal dartboard.

I’m fair certain that AA will never effect this girl. Why? Because she is rich! Her parents can pay for her education out of their change jar. They have means beyond the average American. They have means beyond the above average American. She is a legacy entrant if ever there was one, and if not she’ll get in on the basis of who her parents are and the fact that they can pay out of pocket.

That being said, AA should be use to help those who do not have the means to pay for, but the ability to excel in college. Color should have no basis in it. Only need and ability.

Shawn C on February 29, 2012 at 4:50 am

Affirmative Action is discrimination, and it’s revenge plain and simple. It’s revenge because the basis was obstensibly to make up for past discriminations. However, I was always taught that two wrongs don’t make a right. In a nation and society of laws, we don’t take revenge for wrongs. If someone commits a civil wrong, they are compensated. For example, if you through your negligence have a car accident and the other person loses an arm; our judicial system doesn’t allow that person to have your arm amputed in revenge. It’s the same with past discriminatory practices. The people that are benifitting from the practice of Affirmative Action most likely weren’t victims of the past discrimination that motivated the system, and the “majority” people who are now being injured by it most likely weren’t doing the discrimination.

Customs4Ever on February 29, 2012 at 9:11 am

Anything the pols can do to divide and conquer they will do. The balkanization of our once great country continues unabated. For myself, my one-drop bi-racial Jewish kid will check off whatever boxes get him the most free cheese.

bikerrich on February 29, 2012 at 9:50 am

Excellent column Debbie. I agree that AA is a racist, sexist and biased policy. I’ve seen it practiced in a few different jobs I have had in the government and commercial sectors

I am just your typical white guy who served in the USMC, but I am also a disabled vet. I’m sure everybody has seen the check boxes on employment applications where they ask about veteran status and disability. I always check the box for disabled veteran because that type of info can come up when a background investigation is done on me. I highly doubt anybody ever hired me because I was a disabled vet. However, the IRS gives huge tax credits to places that employ disabled vets. So does this make me an active participant in AA?

Jarhead on February 29, 2012 at 10:38 am

In any questionaire, when asked to fill up race, I always check ‘Decline to identify’. My race? Indian-American (dot, not feather)

Infidel on February 29, 2012 at 11:17 am

Ouch Debbie, it hurt me to read this. As much as I have experienced black anti-semitism, and reverse racism, and that has been quite a lot, I find that there is more redemption in those that have the courage to climb out of the ghetto educated and drug free. We could encourage this.
No the daughter of the Rock should not benefit from affirmative action purely based on family income.
As for using the term “crack whore” interchangably with black mothers it reminds me of how ant-semites use “international banker” interchangably with Jew.
The black ghetto is f**ked up. Why? is a complicated question. It seems that Darwin’s survival theory here is spot regarding cities like Detroit where apparently its a bucket of crabs, and a crapshoot for survival on a mountain of shit.
Ron Paul’s supporters use the same logic regarding Jews and Israel, they don’t care who is right or wrong, they just do not want to honor any American committments that their lilly white asses did not approve, especially if it involves Jews.

Ron Wolf aka "Columbo" on February 29, 2012 at 1:15 pm

You are so right. I would also like to live in your world where a black skin no longer is a reason to be refused a job. and where Jews do not have to keep to their neighborhoods hopefully to not hear the pejoritives.
Would be nice if Muslims had an ecumenical revelation and renounced all the Jew hatred spouted by Mohammed.
Kumbaya.

Ron Wolf aka "Columbo" on February 29, 2012 at 1:34 pm

I wonder if Debbie would support AA if instead of race it was based on financial need?

Shawn C on March 2, 2012 at 4:52 am

All you people who are against affirmative actions and believe it only benefits blacks and/or Hispanics. Believe me, white people have affirmative action also, they just call it “LEGENCY.” And for any ignorant blacks who agrees with these Klansmen, you are the worst sellout imaginable. As a real black professional, I’ve earned everything I have through hard work and dedication, but I also realized that for every me out there, there are several others who were not as fortunate. As for you Klansmen out there, no I did not achieve success from Playing sports, “Gangsta” Rapping, or selling drugs. I achieve my success by defending this country, obtaining my Masters (yes, 2 Master Degrees), doing the hard work that was demanded. Oh, and for the person who wrote about black crackwhore moms, you need to look at you own race. Your mobbed up Fathers, Uncles, Brother and/or Grandfathers may have introduce crack to the black communities, however; there are just as many (if not more) rich, white Republicans Moms, Daughters and Granddaughters who are now the crackwhores. That is when your lily white husband, sons, or uncles are not shooting up businesses because they lost their job. Or maybe even shooting up schools and colleges because they were picked on, or because crackwhore mommy or rich daddy didn’t love them.

And finally, in case you haven’t been keeping up with the national news, the Supreme Court of this country has been brought and paid for by the Republicans Party. It won’t be long before those fools put us poor blacks back in slavery. Way to go, now why don’t you do us all a favor and go find out where your children are, we affirmative action people have children in schools across this nation and would like for them to return home safe because you child is at home trying to figure out ways he/she can kill you and get their inheritance. Sorry, they just really don’t won’t to work now.

dan on June 25, 2012 at 7:50 am

Used your info for a blog posting.

Affirmative Action is Reverse Discrimination:

http://kraxinlogic.com/2012/09/09/reverse-discrimination/

I appreciate any reposts.

Kraxinlogic on October 21, 2012 at 1:00 pm

Affrimative Action is a result of cause and effect. If EVERYONE had been treated fairly when they arrived on these shores, there would be no need for it. The plan was brought in at a time when hardly any person of color could get anywhere in life.

I agree that the children of color whose parents/guardians have the means to send them to college should not even be considered when it comes to Affirmative Action because it really should be used for those who really are disadvantaged, no matter what their color or religious preference. That system needs to be overhauled. However, with the current sentiments being thrown about because of the current president, if Affirmative Action was not in place on a federal level, we would be headed back to “Jim Crow”.

P on April 1, 2013 at 9:14 am

She is not Asian, that is incorrect.
Asian is a completely different nationality from Samoan.
Samoa is in Polynesia, not Asia. She’s 1/4 Polynesian.

Alessa on April 16, 2013 at 2:33 am

If you were really fighting for the cause why use a little lady who never defied, nor came across your line or point. Get your facts right!! And all that you mentioned above in favor of your argument states your stupidity and lack of perspective knowledge into the subject. This relevates your improbableness and how big loser you are in life sitting at home and beating about something that ain’t never happened and through all this you were pulling a child, this shows where on earth you stand. And Ive laughed to my hearts as I read that “unAmerican” You are a fool one of your own kind that doesn’t understand Law & Constitution. GROW UP!!

Subbu John on April 18, 2013 at 3:05 pm

Yea that is just plain un-American. You know what IS American though? Slavery. And the repercussions thereof that have facilitated the rich in getting richer and the poor in getting poorer with a strong racial dividing line between these social classes. Yea, now that’s American. So lets support it by doing nothing to balance the scales.

Unanimous on July 21, 2013 at 1:14 pm